My new old 240D has some issues. Please, ideas, suggestions, input needed.

Hey Mark, California, Ohio....and anyone else that wants to chime in.
Okay, today I took my complete filter assy to Napa and using Californias part #s I was able to get the filter element for the fuel filter assy. Lucky for me I've got the bowl with the molded nub at the bottom.....so a spring wasn't needed. And as Mark suggested, I picked up some Napa fuel conditioner. But, the tractor doesn't seem to run any better. To me, it still seems to be lacking some umph. Remember, I've never had one of these engines before but having to put the hand throttle to full forward position each time I start it just doesn't seem right.....and California has confirmed that it should start just a few inches off the rearward position. And again, even if I run it for a little bit and warm it up, I still need to go all the way forward to get it to run. Then, of course, I've got to immediately pull the throttle back so as not to rev to high. At that point, I can pretty much get it down to 1000 RPM and sustain...but once I get down to between 900 & 800 RPM...she just begins to die off and I've got to jam the Throttle forward again to bring it back up. So, I'm wondering what to do next. Remember, the filter assy had no filter element in it......and the rearward overflow tube that runs back to the tank was plugged. Could it be that I have crap in the injector pump, the tubes that run from the injector pump to the injectors or in the injectors themselves? It almost seems that it's running on only 1 cyl...but not sure how to determing that. I'm ready and willing to tear into these things....of course, the knowledge you guys have will be the deciding factor. But either way, I've got to get her running right.
I pulled the starter out again tonight and since I have to take my daughter to the dentist tomorrow AM, I figured I'd take the starter with me and go to a small shop that I've taken alternators to before. Have the guy test it and maybe have him go through it if he suggests. Anyway, thats where I am tonight. Man, it's killin' me to have the tractor sittin' out there nearly unuseable....but then again, I'm fixing little things each day, learning more about it each day....and heck, I've only had it 4 days....so I guess that's not too bad. I'd just like to be able to put it to work. Anyway, I hope to get some input from you guys as to what I should do next.
 
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Just out of curiosity what is the engine RPM for PTO operations?
If it is something over 3000...then your proper idle is probably higher than you think it should be...:)
Also, when the throttle is at maximum...how many engine RPM are you showing?

Things to check if...
Engine Does Not Develop Full Power
1.Air cleaner restricted
2.Low cetane fuel
3.Incorrect timing
4.Diesel automatic advance is faulty or not operating
5.Filter clogged
6.Air leak on the suction side of the system
7.Injection nozzles return lines clogged
8.Injection nozzles faulty or sticking
9.Injection pump return fuel line or fittings restricted
10.Injection pump housing not full of fuel
11.One or more connector screws obstructed
12.Water in fuel
13.Injection pump 180 degrees out of time
 
even if I run it for a little bit and warm it up, I still need to go all the way forward to get it to run. Then, of course, I've got to immediately pull the throttle back so as not to rev to high.
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Doesn't sound right.

A warm start with the hand throttle about 4-5 inches up from zero should catch on the first compression stroke and be idling at about 1200 within 2-3 strokes, without touching the throttle. The warm start sound should be the starter straining for an instant to spin the heavy flywheel and push it through that first compression stroke, then instantly a smooth steady idle.

With it idling, you might crack open one fuel line at its injector, then the other, to judge if each cylinder is contributing its share of the power. Safety concern: The fuel is at 2000 psi and is dangerous. It can be injected into the skin and poison you. I understand cutting it out surgically is the only way to save your life. Think this one through before trying it! Protect your eyes!!! I've never done this. I think I would crack the lines with the engine off and see if it will warm-start on each cylinder separately.

Just out of curiosity what is the engine RPM for PTO operations?
If it is something over 3000...then your proper idle is probably higher than you think it should be...:)
Also, when the throttle is at maximum...how many engine RPM are you showing?
Click to expand...
YM240 Operator Manual says:
YM240tach.jpg
But over 1600 rpm sounds painfully fast, at 2000 it sounds like it is going to grenade, and PTO speed (2200) or more is painful to listen to. These things fire the second cylinder 180 degrees after the first one. But it's a 4 stroke so then nothing fires for another 540 crankshaft degrees, more than a full rotation. Then more racket. They inherently sound badly imbalanced.

Apparently they just built everything super-tough and the operator is supposed to ignore the racket.

They don't build em like that any more!
 
California said:
Doesn't sound right.

A warm start with the hand throttle about 4-5 inches up from zero should catch on the first compression stroke and be idling at about 1200 within 2-3 strokes, without touching the throttle. The warm start sound should be the starter straining for an instant to spin the heavy flywheel and push it through that first compression stroke, then instantly a smooth steady idle.

With it idling, you might crack open one fuel line at its injector, then the other, to judge if each cylinder is contributing its share of the power. Safety concern: The fuel is at 2000 psi and is dangerous. It can be injected into the skin and poison you. I understand cutting it out surgically is the only way to save your life. Think this one through before trying it! Protect your eyes!!! I've never done this. I think I would crack the lines with the engine off and see if it will warm-start on each cylinder separately.

YM240 Operator Manual says:
View attachment 2235
But over 1600 rpm sounds painfully fast, at 2000 it sounds like it is going to grenade, and PTO speed (2200) or more is painful to listen to. These things fire the second cylinder 180 degrees after the first one. But it's a 4 stroke so then nothing fires for another 540 crankshaft degrees, more than a full rotation. Then more racket. They inherently sound badly imbalanced.

Apparently they just built everything super-tough and the operator is supposed to ignore the racket.

They don't build em like that any more!
Click to expand...

Interesting that YANMARs have lower RPMs in their own tractors than they do in the yanmar powered John Deeres...:rolleyes:
 
Hey Paul....thanks for the check list......I'll go through each if needed...unfortunately right now I've got the starter out and was hoping that a local shop that I'd used before would be able to diagnose my starter. I found out today that he closed his business 2 years ago. So, now I'm shopping for starter drive for my starter.....or possibly a complete starter. Will keep you posted on my progress though. And as soon as I get the tractor started, then I can begin troubleshooting again.

PaulChristenson said:
Just out of curiosity what is the engine RPM for PTO operations?
If it is something over 3000...then your proper idle is probably higher than you think it should be...:)
Also, when the throttle is at maximum...how many engine RPM are you showing?

Things to check if...
Engine Does Not Develop Full Power
1.Air cleaner restricted
2.Low cetane fuel
3.Incorrect timing
4.Diesel automatic advance is faulty or not operating
5.Filter clogged
6.Air leak on the suction side of the system
7.Injection nozzles return lines clogged
8.Injection nozzles faulty or sticking
9.Injection pump return fuel line or fittings restricted
10.Injection pump housing not full of fuel
11.One or more connector screws obstructed
12.Water in fuel
13.Injection pump 180 degrees out of time
Click to expand...
 
Hey California,
Well, I guess right now I can't report a lot...cause my starters out of the tractor but I have ordered a starter drive.....hopefully that will resolve the starter issue.
When my starter works, my motor seems to turn over pretty easily...so to be honest, I have't used the compression release lever....I keep forgetting about it. I hope the fact that my motor isn't hard to turn over isn't going to end up being the problem...cause then I'd have to start thinking about engine tear down....but I think it's a little early for me to be getting paranoid about that.
But, we all agree that after my tractors warmed up, it should start with the throttle well below the " full forward " position. I like the idea of cracking one fuel line at a time....with the engine off...and then attempting to start the tractor....just to see if each cylinder is getting fuel and can run. That should be safe if only running for a few seconds. I could always wrap a rag around the end if the disconnected line to keep fuel from spewing.

California said:
Doesn't sound right.

A warm start with the hand throttle about 4-5 inches up from zero should catch on the first compression stroke and be idling at about 1200 within 2-3 strokes, without touching the throttle. The warm start sound should be the starter straining for an instant to spin the heavy flywheel and push it through that first compression stroke, then instantly a smooth steady idle.

With it idling, you might crack open one fuel line at its injector, then the other, to judge if each cylinder is contributing its share of the power. Safety concern: The fuel is at 2000 psi and is dangerous. It can be injected into the skin and poison you. I understand cutting it out surgically is the only way to save your life. Think this one through before trying it! Protect your eyes!!! I've never done this. I think I would crack the lines with the engine off and see if it will warm-start on each cylinder separately.
I had no idea that working RPMs were so high.....and actually, I feel that it probably runs okay at those higher RPMs, but still, checking that both cylinders get are getting fuel will make me feel more at ease. I am not out at the tractor right now, but I remember there being a " red line " on the tach just above 2200 RPM I believe.....but, on the attachment, it shows " full throttle at full load " at 2400 RPM and that would put the gauge at past the red line....So, I guess the red line on this gauge is not your typical red line? You are so right about as the RPMs increase, the motor sounds like the R's are too much for it. But, I don't have an ear for these motors yet. I've got so much to learn about these things. And right now, all us mute because I don't have the starter in and am waiting for parts to fix the drive in the starter. But as soon as it arrives I'll be installing and then I can go from there. I really believe that I should check fuel delivery all the way up to the injectors. If I'm getting sufficient fuel to both injectors, then is it possible to check injectors to see if fuel is being properly atomized in the cone shape that is required for proper running?
Well, now I guess I just wait for the starter parts so I can get back to trouble shooting.

YM240 Operator Manual says:
View attachment 2235
But over 1600 rpm sounds painfully fast, at 2000 it sounds like it is going to grenade, and PTO speed (2200) or more is painful to listen to. These things fire the second cylinder 180 degrees after the first one. But it's a 4 stroke so then nothing fires for another 540 crankshaft degrees, more than a full rotation. Then more racket. They inherently sound badly imbalanced.

Apparently they just built everything super-tough and the operator is supposed to ignore the racket.

They don't build em like that any more!
Click to expand...
 
Hey.....I've been a little bummed today only because I've got to wait on some starter parts before I can get back to driving the tractor and troubleshootin....But, one issue I can attempt to resolve are the tires...or at least one of them. The other night I tried putting some air in....letting some out...and nothing and it was suggested that someone may have used some type of sealant on the tires...and it's possibly gummed up the valve stems. Anyway, I guess I can jack up one side or both and get those valves near the top and try to remove the stems.....maybe figure out what's going on there. I do have a question regarding the motor in my tractor. Can anyone tell me if there is a number stamped or an ID tag anywhere on the tractor or engine that will tell me which motor I have. All I know is that it's a 2 cyl diesel probably assembled between '77 & '81 and it is 24HP. I was asked today by a small auto parts house if I knew the exact engine designation #......I couldn't answer.
 
Of course California can tell you what engine is in his, yours will be the same. Mark also has a detailed list as to what engine is in what tractor.
It's something like TR20XX. I think there is a plate on the left side of the engine down near the clutch pedal that has the engine number and the serial number of the tractor.
 
Hey, thanks Ohio........guess I'll go out right now and see if I can find that plate. I'd been meaning to ask you guys this question since I got the tractor....but man, my memory isn't what it once was......I think....I can't remember if it was any better earlier in life:pat:

OhioTC18 said:
Of course California can tell you what engine is in his, yours will be the same. Mark also has a detailed list as to what engine is in what tractor.
It's something like TR20XX. I think there is a plate on the left side of the engine down near the clutch pedal that has the engine number and the serial number of the tractor.
Click to expand...
 
The engine model is 2TR20A-X, on a green tag riveted to the block by the starter. The engine serial number is stamped in the block nearby.

The tractor S/N is YM240D- xxx, (about #12,000 for that one). It is stamped in the transmission by the driver's left ankle.

There should be a S/N tag (metallized adhesive label) on the left fender behind your left elbow, but it's missing off mine so I can't describe it better.

And a reason for asking the S/N is to determine which 'Revision Level' it is. That tractor is Revision Level 4, evidenced by the external air cleaner that was never used before Level 4. (Which was the final year of YM240 production.)

My Revision Level 3 was the last to have a hood banner showing 'Yanmar YM240'. (and that decal is now unobtainable). Level 4 had the generic 'Yanmar Diesel Tractor' decal that is seen on many later Yanmars.
 
Hey Guys,
Well, I had some time to work on the tractor today. I put the starter back in cause I needed to fire it up and get the grader/box out of the back of my pickup...it's been in the truck since the day I got the tractor home. Hopefully my starter parts will be here tomorrow and I can solve the intermittent starter gear issue.
I'd never messed with the 3 pt stuff, but figured today was as good as any, so, after using the tractor to lift the box out of the truck...I disconnected the mower from the 3 ph and connected the box.....and hey, that was pretty easy. I even took time to figure out how to adjust the box...hoping I got it right. Then, backed the tractor up to the garage, jacked it up and removed the valve core from the stem on the tire that was really low. If you remember, I couldn't put air in or get any air out. Even after I removed the stem, nothing. But, attached to the stem, was another peice that unscrewed, with the help of some pliers. This is what the core was in. As soon as I removed that peice...a little air escapted. So, I took my air hose and blew that peice out and a bunch of wet crap came out. Blew the core off really good to. Put it all back in and I was able to add air and now the tires up! Yahoo...I feel much safer and better about that.
But, suddenly today, while I was positioning the bucket over my truck bed to get the box out, I noticed the bucket was slowly lowering...really slow, but lowering none the less. I got off to take a look and noticed that the left side had hydralic fluid dripping a little....looks like it's coming from that ram right at the rear...possibly a seal? Any quick fixes or ideas on that? Just my luck...I get the tire issue resolved and find another problem.
Now for something kind of interesting. You guys know I know nothing about this tractor...or at least didn't know anything until I started talking to you guys about it. Well, I may have been totally wrong about the way it was running....it may be running perfectly well. I say this cause I took a better look at some pics that a member on another site sent me showing the position of the throttle. In one pic it shows where the throttle lever should be in the idle and full forward positions. Well, I went out to the tractor...and my full forward position is about the position the throttle lever is in the pic......mine doesn't even get to a full " straight up " position. So, I took a look at the linkage and right off the bat I can see that the linkage bar that runs up to the lever that is attached to the block (sorry, I'll get the right termonolgy once I've looked at a manual with part names) is really sloppy...missing some washers to keep it tight. But, the peice that that actually pivots on a rod has a screw that keeps it clamped to the rod that looks as though it goes into the block...well that screw is too long....so, when I push my throttle to full forward, it's actually only going about 1/2 the distance it shows in the pic posted here. That's because the end of that screw is hitting the side of the injector pump and stopping the throttle from going any further. Which means...that all this time I thought I was at full throttle to start the tractor, when actually, I may not be forward enough to start it properly. So, I'm going out right now and see if I can solve that issue. And who know...maybe this thing is running right....just not getting enough fuel to start as it should. Back later with any progress.
 
Splat, I went out and looked at mine.

At 99% throttle, the lever coming out of the injector pump is vertical. At 100%, that lever's bottom edge is about 1/16" beyond vertical.

That lever is attached at the midpoint of the threaded rod, with a nut on each side of the lever's swivel.

At 99% throttle, the hand throttle lever has just reached the rubber hood gasket. At 100% the hand throttle is even with the far edge of the hood gasket.

Also where that lever on the pump goes into the pump, there is a lead seal on a wire like on an electric meter. Same purpose, to reveal tampering with the pump calibration which can only be set by experts.

Hope this helps!
 
Hey California,
Well, I thought I had things figured out...but now I'm confused again. I've included pics of my throttle position at 100% and the lever down by the pump at 100%. Do you have a manual? I was sent a pic of the different throttle positions from the manual...page 16, Fig 34. Looking at the diagram, the pic shows full throttle at about the 2 oclock position and idle position about 11 oclock...both if you are standing directly at the side of the tractor. Mine doesn't get anywhere near the 2 oclock position...mine is just less than 12 oclock. Also, yes, mine has the lead seal on the screw that goes through and holds the lever on the pivot....does the end of the screw on yours hit the side of the injector pump? My throttle doesn't go any further because the end of the screw hits the injector. As far as the threaded rod, as you can see in my pics...mine is adjusted a little to the left of center on the adjustment rod...but that's only because I was fooling with it...but originally, it was right in the middle. So, I'm not sure what's going on. I don't know if the pic I was sent from the page in the manual is actually where the hand throttle should be at when at full throttle, but mine isn't close. Although it sounds not too far off of where yours sits at full throttle. Any thoughts. I was thinking that if my linkage/throttle adjustment is off, then maybe my hand throttle is not at full throttle when I'm trying to start the tractor like I thought....but I just don't know. But like I say, that screw hits the injector pump and stops the throttle....and maybe that is the way it is supposed to be. Let me know what you think...or if yours has the screw that hits the pump. Thanks.
Brian

California said:
Splat, I went out and looked at mine.

At 99% throttle, the lever coming out of the injector pump is vertical. At 100%, that lever's bottom edge is about 1/16" beyond vertical.

That lever is attached at the midpoint of the threaded rod, with a nut on each side of the lever's swivel.

At 99% throttle, the hand throttle lever has just reached the rubber hood gasket. At 100% the hand throttle is even with the far edge of the hood gasket.

Also where that lever on the pump goes into the pump, there is a lead seal on a wire like on an electric meter. Same purpose, to reveal tampering with the pump calibration which can only be set by experts.

Hope this helps!
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I made similar pictures, but I'm not sure what this is telling us.

At 100% throttle the hand levers look about the same.

I see my lever from the injector pump is advanced farther than yours when the maximum-throttle screw hits the end stop ... but ... looking at the lead seal on mine, the seal is is simply hanging down. I think it should look like yours, wired back to that tiny hole on the left. Maybe mine has been tampered with while yours is original.

Mark, can you hear us? Anybody? How are the lever and seal supposed to look?

I wonder if the maximum throttle screw was backed out on mine to allow farther throttle advance.P1190241rYMHandThrottle&LoaderCtl.jpg P1190243rYMInjPump.jpg

Off topic, but I thought someone might be interested: wiring a kid-size golf bag into the loader chassis made a great place to carry my chains. I originally put it there to carry a cordless recipro saw like a carbine saddle holster, to trim stuff in the orchard.

There's a second golf bag wired to the ROPS in back for shovel (irrigation) and pruning shears.
 
The throttle lever position is a matter of personal preference (within a few inches) as the threaded link is what actually dictates the injection pump lever to convert position to RPM. Readjusting by loosening the stop nuts and threading out/in the throttle metering rod to and from idle to full throttle is fairly straightforward.

With the tractor running and the stop nuts loosened you can dial in the throttle position that is most comfortable from the operators station. I haven't had the pleasure of a YM240 in my shop but have adjusted the links to just under maximum recommended RPM on the high side....and below idle for fuel shut-off for the low side on just about every model I have...or have worked on (that needed it).

The lead seal has no bearing on throttle travel, is calibrated from the factory, and I've never had to change the position or cut the seal. Clear as MUD?? Hope this helps a little.

Mark
 
Mark, is the seal wire supposed to go back to the tiny hole in the rear side of the screw? Looking at splat's photo, my seal wire looks like it's just hanging there doing nothing. Are your tractors wired like mine, or splat's?

I wonder what that little screw is for? I never paid attention to it, but after thinking about this, it must control maximum governor advance. Is this a limit on rpm, or on fuel quantity under heavy load?

I adjusted the throttle rod like you described as part of my initial setup, and didn't notice that the lead seal wire doesn't seem to do anything. I think it should go through that rear tiny hole to prevent turning the limit screw.

Now I'm the one with more questions than answers!
 
Good morning Mark & California,
California, the lead seal on mine goes through the nut on the forward side of the lever....then goes through something, possibly the screw itself, on the rearward side of the lever. It looks as though it has never been removed. But definitely that screw stops against the injector pump. Looking at the adjustment rod, no amount of adjustment at the rod will make any difference as to how far that lever can go toward the front of the tractor because the screw against the injector pump stops it. I would think that the adjustment rod would only change the positions of the hand throttle itself....I guess. Can anyone tell me what maximum..or recommended maximum rpm's are for this engine? I'd kind of like to see if I can get to recommended max....but don't want to launch any parts through the block. This engine has a govener doesn't it? It looks as though on California's hand throttle can be moved about an inch or a little more forward than mine will go....but I will mess with the adjustment and see what I can do about that this morning and be back a little later with any progress.
California said:
Mark, is the seal wire supposed to go back to the tiny hole in the rear side of the screw? Looking at splat's photo, my seal wire looks like it's just hanging there doing nothing. Are your tractors wired like mine, or splat's?

I wonder what that little screw is for? I never paid attention to it, but after thinking about this, it must control maximum governor advance. Is this a limit on rpm, or on fuel quantity under heavy load?

I adjusted the throttle rod like you described as part of my initial setup, and didn't notice that the lead seal wire doesn't seem to do anything. I think it should go through that rear tiny hole to prevent turning the limit screw.

Now I'm the one with more questions than answers!
Click to expand...
 
On the starter, if the bendix is kicking out when bench testing, then you may have a bad bendix (starter gear/clutch). The solenoid can kick the gear out just fine, but if the clutch inside is going bad, then it just spins without turning the gear.
 
Thanks olcowhand.....yeah, I've got the starter gear assy on it's way.


olcowhand said:
On the starter, if the bendix is kicking out when bench testing, then you may have a bad bendix (starter gear/clutch). The solenoid can kick the gear out just fine, but if the clutch inside is going bad, then it just spins without turning the gear.
Click to expand...
 
Hey Mark and California,
Well, I received a manual. I'm think I may have over reacted about my tractor not running right. Although Californias tractor starts when warm only a few inches up from the "off " position of the hand throttle, the manual says to start the tractor in the full throttle position....which is the only place mine will start. It doesn't say anything about any other position whether the tractor is warm or not. The only other starting sequence that differs is if using the TS starting method in cold weather. And it states that the de-compression lever should be used for any starting method. And since the guy who was showing me the tractor and telling me all he knew about the tractor(which now I see wasn't much) never even used the de-compression lever....I was just under the assumption that my tractor wasn't running right. Also, I now think that the picture in the manual that I was using as a reference for the positioning of the hand throttle was just that.....just a reference picture....showing the forward most postion...and then showing an approximate " part throttle idle " position.....so I may have been taking the pic for way more than I should have. Only the other day I started using the decompression lever, and that made it a lot easier to start....a lot easier. Hopefully tomorrow I will have my starter gear assy and then starting the tractor will be that much easier. Oh, and I used it off an on for about 3 hours yesterday. I got it into a small area in the back of our property...not real level and just took my time. I used the 4WD and the differential lock......man, it digs in! I pulled out a bunch of manzanita stumps and 2 manzanita bushes that were still growing...not a problem.
I guess my biggest problem is fixing the hand throttle so it doesn't slow vibrate back to the off position. Mark had mentioned something about dimpling the leather washer or something like that, but I couldn't see one. Are you talking about the throttle lever pivot area kind of near the " right " knee area ? Right now, I think that's one issue that really needs to be fixed....along with my trans jumping out of the 2 low gears. Anyway, not working on the tractor today.....but tomorrow I am going at it hard again, just trying to fix some little things.
 
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