Chinese Mahindras???

[Dougster]

Doug, It is only one model, They are not abandoning the rest. And by the way I also saw the Indian Mahindra made replacements for the 10 series tractors. It looked good.

Respectfully Galen, it's not about the number of cheap, downscale models they plan to import. To me, it's all about what's behind the brand. It's about brand positioning, perceptions and reputation in the American market. But I won't continue to belabor the point. All I can say is that ALL of the reasons I became interested in Mahindra and ultimately bought a Mahindra run counter to the new direction in which M&M and M-USA seem to want to go.

It's kinda like having chosen a BMW (or Volvo or Audi, etc.)... and then finding out that BMW plans to start importing Yugo's next year and have them wearing the BMW badge. It kinda kills the brand image and level of respect in the marketplace if ya know what I mean.

Dougster

 

[Dougster]

Galen
Now you caught my interest, are the Korean versions of the 10 series OFFICIALLY gone???? in 10-20 years when my grand kids are working on my 4110, , are they out of luck for parts or will Mahindra maintain some sort of parts inventory ,or will they have to spend my life insurance money to buy that Chinese made John Deere

As you must know Buck, most of your tractor's parts are TYM parts anyway... and I think they will be around for quite a while. Your engine is from Daedong/Kioti and your FEL is from KMW. Your BH, if any, is from Bradco. I will be long dead and gone before 10-series parts ever become a problem.

Dougster

 

[Dougster]

Exactly what Mahindra's problem is,, they don't listen and secondly, they take forever to come out with something, in the meantime, they continually lose to other competition,.. I said in an earlier post that the big shots won't listen and this is what happens from it.

Folks like Galen certainly listen... and I appreciate the fact that they are interested in owner feedback... but the folks at the top don't seem to be tuned into owner feedback at all. They seem to do things in a vacuum.

And if they did listen (and I just don't know it), I would love to talk to the owner(s) that must have told M-USA: "Ya know I love my high-quality Mahindra... but I really would have preferred a crappy, unproven, Chinese-made tractor... sorta like a Jinma but red... so I could have saved a few bucks each month on the payment."

Ya think it may have happened that way???

Dougster

 

[shinnlinger]

Dougster,

Jinmas already are red and I haven't head horrendous things about them (but to be honest I havent heard any thing great about them either). Yes they have some issues with seals and pumps and no they are not as user freindly but they are also 1/2 the price of a kubota, so I don't think they should be considered in the same light as kubota.

Now when I re read my posts it appears I am defending China, and I really dont feel that way, but I will say this. The "name brand" tools that are made in China are clearly superior to Harbor Freight caliber tools that may even be made in the same factory. And it because of this I am basing my statement that the Chinese CAN make something decent IF they want to. This is more about quality control than country of orgin.

I also wonder if the TYM fiasco was a learning point to the chinese, that if you are going to make crap, you aren't going to make my our tractors.

I am also wondering why I ever ventured into this thread.

 

[PaulChristenson]

I am also wondering why I ever ventured into this thread.

You ventured into this thread because you did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night...

 

[Dougster]

Dougster, Jinmas already are red and I haven't head horrendous things about them (but to be honest I havent heard any thing great about them either). Yes they have some issues with seals and pumps and no they are not as user freindly but they are also 1/2 the price of a kubota, so I don't think they should be considered in the same light as kubota.

Let me be clear that I have nothing whatsoever against Jinma tractors. People who buy them with their eyes wide open know exactly what they are getting (and brother, it ain't no Kubota!) and that is fine. There is no fraud or deception being perpetrated there... no one has misrepresented a Jinma to be anything other than what it is. Personally, I would never buy one, but if folks want one that is totally fine with me.

Now when I re read my posts it appears I am defending China, and I really dont feel that way, but I will say this. The "name brand" tools that are made in China are clearly superior to Harbor Freight caliber tools that may even be made in the same factory. And it because of this I am basing my statement that the Chinese CAN make something decent IF they want to. This is more about quality control than country of orgin.

Everyone talks "quality control"... that the defective/dangerous China products problem is just a matter of adding more "QC" checks... but I think the China problem goes much deeper than that. I think there are serious raw materials issues and a worker ethic (or lack thereof) that prevents that sense of ownership or personal pride in the finished product. I feel this is cultural and will take a long time to change, if it ever does. The fact that all these products are being produced for export adds to the psychological (and actual) "distance" between worker/producer and end user.

I also wonder if the TYM fiasco was a learning point to the Chinese, that if you are going to make crap, you aren't going to make my our tractors..

I think (hope?) it was more of a lesson for TYM than for China. TYM makes excellent tractors in South Korea... but the China tractor was a bad joke and a fraud. It quickly died a well-deserved death.

I am also wondering why I ever ventured into this thread.

Because you have an adventurous spirit and love a good, feisty debate?

Dougster

 

[civesnedfield]

Man oh man. I have nothing really pertentaint to add to this thread other than the fact that it has given me a hankerin' for so Chinese food. Doug you buying.

 

[Dougster]

Man oh man. I have nothing really pertentaint to add to this thread other than the fact that it has given me a hankerin' for so Chinese food. Doug you buying.

No good Chinese food around here Ed. There's some very cheap, semi-edible take-out over on the other side of town, but I wouldn't recommend it unless you become dirt poor like moi.

Otherwise, be prepared for a L-O-N-G drive in the old A.R.E.!!!

Dougster

 

[civesnedfield]

No good Chinese food around here Ed. There's some very cheap, semi-edible take-out over on the other side of town, but I wouldn't recommend it unless you become dirt poor like moi.

Otherwise, be prepared for a L-O-N-G drive in the old A.R.E.!!!

Dougster

Najust kidding already ate dinner. Just in it for the cheap laugh.

 

[Dougster]

Najust kidding already ate dinner. Just in it for the cheap laugh.

Let me take a wild guess: Lobsta and Fillet Mignon again???

Dougster

 

[civesnedfield]

Let me take a wild guess: Lobsta and Fillet Mignon again???

Dougster

But of course.

 

[Dougster]

You ventured into this thread because you did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night...

Stay Smart®!!!

Dougster

 

[Bindian]

I am thinking the Chinese bult Mahindras will be like those few years Harley Davidson motorcycles were bought and mfg. by a company (I can't remember the name) that did shoddy work. The bikes were really messed up those years and no one that knew wanted a bike from those years. Now, years later, the Harley name is big time. I will just wait and see.
hugs, Brandi

 

[Dougster]

I am thinking the Chinese bult Mahindras will be like those few years Harley Davidson motorcycles were bought and mfg. by a company (I can't remember the name) that did shoddy work. The bikes were really messed up those years and no one that knew wanted a bike from those years. Now, years later, the Harley name is big time. I will just wait and see.
hugs, Brandi

I believe you are referring to the AMF (American Machine & Foundry) fiasco that nearly killed Harley-Davidson.

I think this China tractor thing is quite different. I try to understand the logic of going cheap and downscale instead of staying on the upscale, reputation-building path... but it totally escapes me. If I were sitting in the M-USA offices tonight, seems I'd want to continue competing successfully against the Big 3 (or 4 or 5 depending on your perspective) with profitable high-end tractors rather than try to compete with dubious, unproven crap against Jinma.

But when you make a whopping $1.57 an hour... nobody wants to listen.

Dougster

 

[GLAWALL]

Buck,
One thing I have learned in this business is there is more profits in selling parts than selling tractors. This is the case with all of the brands. I am sure parts will be available for a long time. I can still get parts for my 1938 Allis Chalmers WF tractor. All I have to do is go to the Agco dealer. They aren't cheap but are still being produced and are available.

Galen LaWall
Your Mahindra Tractor Dealer
Batavia, NY

 

[PaulChristenson]

I believe you are referring to the AMF (American Machine & Foundry) fiasco that nearly killed Harley-Davidson.

I think this China tractor thing is quite different. I try to understand the logic of going cheap and downscale instead of staying on the upscale, reputation-building path... but it totally escapes me. If I were sitting in the M-USA offices tonight, seems I'd want to continue competing successfully against the Big 3 (or 4 or 5 depending on your perspective) with profitable high-end tractors rather than try to compete with dubious, unproven crap against Jinma.

But when you make a whopping $1.57 an hour... nobody wants to listen.

Dougster

Making crap under the name of a well respected company name is nothing new...When you have US style bonuses paid to the executives with golden parachutes...Why would ANYBODY be surprised by M-USA's current marketing direction...We are entering a recession...Therefore the company sells chinese Ms at a SLIGHTLY cheaper price than the current US/Indian Ms and in their mind's eye, they are going to clean up...and by the time the proverbial manure hits the fan...they will be either ready for retirement or they will get the golden parachute...for the execs its a WIN/WIN...anyone who buys this junk its going to be a LOSS...especially when parts become unavailable...


As a change has anyone seen products marketed under the Westinghouse brand recently???
Care to guess who bought their NAME???

 

[Dougster]

Making crap under the name of a well respected company name is nothing new...When you have US style bonuses paid to the executives with golden parachutes...Why would ANYBODY be surprised by M-USA's current marketing direction.

I never said I was surprised. Just disgusted and disappointed.

As a change has anyone seen products marketed under the Westinghouse brand recently??? Care to guess who bought their NAME???

I believe that would be CMO (Chi Mei Optronics) of Taiwan... same manufacturer of Funai LCD TV sets (Yeech!) and Proview LCD monitors (which I feel are semi-okay). After my 16-year old Sony 27" TV exploded, I looked into buying one (a 42" Westinghouse LCD TV) at BJ's where they are one of the cheapest LCD TV brands... but I felt the picture was a little weak and I decided to wait until the new Sharp's come down in price. For now, I continue to get by with an old 19" Panasonic that used to be in my bedroom. It's kinda small but works okay most of the time.

Dougster

 

[UncleBuck]

I keep hearing rumors and reading stories that the Chinese Mahindras are coming soon to these economically-challenged shores. The very term Chinese Mahindras strikes fear in my heart and brings up some troubling visions and emotions about my favorite tractor brand. I am also reminded of the attempt to do the same by TYM and its ultimate failure along with the confusion and bad feelings it caused.

I am further reminded of exactly why I chose to put my faith (and future) in a Mahindra tractor in the first place. I keep hoping that M-USA knows what it is doing but I fear that this move is purely low-end profit motivated and is doomed to backfire badly by changing the general perception of Mahindra from a rock-solid first class alternative to the Big 3 brands... to just another imported tractor of dubious pedigree and worth.

Please someone tell me that my fears are irrational... or, alternatively, tell me what other brand will ultimately remain 100% qualify-focused and rise to the top of the heap to take the place of Mahindra in challenging Deere, Kubota and New Holland for best value over the next 5-10 years.

Dougster

Dougster
Hate to get you excited, but how do you feel about
"THAILAND-ESE KUBOTA"

I guess now its the Big 2 ????????
They do have DECAF at Starbucks


[SIZE=-1] "Kubota to Export Low-Priced Tractors Made in New Thai Plant"

[/SIZE][SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Tokyo, Dec 28, 2007 (Jiji Press) - [/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Kubota Corp. plans to export low-priced tractors manufactured at its new plant in Thailand, which is scheduled to start operation in 2009, to neighboring countries, the United States and Europe, according to President Daisuke Hatakake.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Hatakake said in a recent interview with Jiji Press that the major Japanese farm equipment maker also plans to supply cast iron pipes produced at its joint venture in India, which was launched this year, to African and Asian markets.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]The company earlier this year announced its entry into the Thai market due to expected demand from the country and neighbors such as Vietnam, where rice cultivation is being rapidly mechanized.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Hatakake said Kubota's tractor sales in Thailand are expected to surpass those in Japan by volume as early as next year.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Suggesting an intention to make the Thai plant a production foothold in the company's Asian business, Hatakake said Asian markets are seen as promising for Kubota due to potential demand for Japanese rice-cropping equipment and large-scale rice fields that are more than three times the size of those in Japan.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Kubota will need to reinforce its facilities in Thailand in the future and the company is eyeing the possibility of establishing a sales company in a neighboring country such as Vietnam, Hatakake said.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Kubota expects to export inexpensive tractors made in Thailand to the United States and Europe, in order to come out on top in fierce competition with low-priced products from India and China, he said.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]On the cast iron pipe operations, Kubota is set to shift its focus from Japan to overseas markets, the president suggested, citing inadequate water infrastructure in the Middle East and Asia outside Japan. The company intends to meet rapidly growing demand in India, while making forays into African and other Asian markets, he said.

[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]
[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]

Article Date: 12-28-2007
Source: JCN Network
Here is the link for this article, the [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Associated Equipment Distributors,

[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1] Kubota to Export Low-Priced Tractors Made in New Thai Plant

[/SIZE][SIZE=-1][FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]

[/FONT][/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]



[/SIZE]

 

[mobilus]

NO, NO, NO, UncleBuck! Say it ain't so!

Okay, at least I got mine before quality goes to hell.

 

[Dougster]

Dougster
Hate to get you excited, but how do you feel about
"THAILAND-ESE KUBOTA" I guess now its the Big 2 ????????
They do have DECAF at Starbucks

[SIZE=-1]"Kubota to Export Low-Priced Tractors Made in New Thai Plant"[/SIZE]

It is an American disease Buck... plain and simple. A race to the bottom rung of the ladder. I am surprised at Kubota. At least it isn't China, but the move is still troubling. I always thought they would be the last holdout for uncompromising quality (even if I personally couldn't afford their excellent machinery). Now where do I turn???

NO, NO, NO, UncleBuck! Say it ain't so! Okay, at least I got mine before quality goes to hell.

There is nowhere left to turn. Quality is a thing of the past and the bottom feeders apparently win. God help us all.

Dougster